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The following feedback was taken from the 1997-99 Feedback CD
which is currently on sale in the TRNi Store.
All 2000 Feedback is posted on the website daily.

 

4L80E...

QUESTION:


Tue Oct 14 20:36:51 PDT 1997
Oh boy here I go again with one of those intermittent problems. Problem is intermittent code 87 by itself with no other codes, which put the transmission in 2nd gear along with max. PSI. I put my Snap-on Scanner on it and got it to act up and recorded a movie. It makes a 1-2 shift then the ecm commands a 2-3 (solenoid 'B" on), and no upshift to 3rd . After 2 seconds of no upshift code 87 tripped. Ratio stays at 1.48 while the ecm commands 3rd, and rpm verifies no upshift took place. I looked at the recorded movie with the scangrafics, but everything is steady, from range sensor to inputs and outputs. The truck has 10,000 miles on it. PSI test shows all pressures normal. I had to drive it about 30 miles to get it to act up. I carried it back to the shop and hooked up the TransX2000 to see if actual voltage is being sent to the 2-3 solenoid. After another 30 miles of driving I gave up on seeing it act up. So I pulled the pan and replace both shift solenoids, and even through in a manifold PSI sensor. Drove it 1 mile and here goes code 87 again, this time it caught me with my pants down, (no scanner or TransX on it, stupid me). I drove it another 50 miles with all equipment on it, but no problems yet. Fluid is cherry by the way. I am sure the direct clutches are in good shape, because I can load test (stall) them with the TransX2000 and watch the turbine sensor for slippage, so internal slippage is not likely. I think I'll pull the valvebody tomorrow, and rot out the solenoid feed holes, and replace the screen that breaks under the manual valve. Any one got any ideas? I remember reading an article in gears about the solenoid feed holes being a little to small, but I don't remember which issue it was in. Man I hate remembering reading something and forgetting where I read it at. Does the Trans Doctor tell where that article is? This is about my 3rd experience with a code 87 by itself, and each time so far it's been something different.
Dan Tucker

RESPONSES;


FIX:


Wed Oct 15 19:42:51 PDT 1997
Yogi & Transman,
Thanks for the replys. Yogi you mentioned that it may be a loose connection (case connector etc), but I think it would have to have some other codes along with the 87. One way I go after finding intermidant codes is clear the codes and try to reproduce the exact codes. If you pull the pan on a 4L80E and disconnect the B solenoid you'll get codes like 81 or 82 because the ecm sees loss of connection. Also I took a movie and when the malfunction took place and the computer commanded 3rd, but the transmission didn't shift to third, the circut feedback to the ecm was OK which means the connection was good during the problem. So my conclusion is the ecm is satisfied that the solenoid operated electically. So I replace it to know that the solenoid operated with fluid. So the problem has to be did the 2-3 shift valve stroke? If it did stroke, then did the oil get delivered to the direct clutch? That is a good question. Let's look at the transmission like it was a 400. If the shift valve were to move and it took say 3 seconds before the direct clutch overcame a small internal leak, and then over came the leak and applied the clutch all at once would we notice it? Probaly not, it would just delay the shift slightly and more than likely go unnoticed. But becauce the ecm is 'birdogging' that clutch, it better come on pretty quick after it COMMANDS it to be on, or it throws us an 87. The kind of delay I am talking about is like a A4LD delaying reverse, then when it comes on bang. No burning of the clutches on the A4LD, just a delay. What do we do to correct it on an A4LD? We enlarge the reverse feed orifice and it's fixed. This brings me to what I think the cause of the 96 4L80E code 87 really is. The 3rd feed hole on the 1996 was only .052. I mic'ed several other older 3rd feeds in the seperater plate and the smallest was .072. We'll you know what I did.....I opened that baby up to .090. I also opened up the solenoid feed holes from .022 to .035, so I know the solenoids have enough oil to stroke the shift valve. This is all I did, and I've driven it 50 miles so far and praise God it's shifting great. Of coarse only time will tell but it does make sense. I am in no way making this post to knock anyones ideas, or try to be a know it all, but only to further all of our knowledge. I've done a lot of research on the code 87 and thought I should share it with TRNi. I'm just like everyone else on TRNi. I'm here to learn from other peoples trial and error. It's a great network!
Dan Tucker

 

4L60E...

QUESTION:


Tue Oct 21 19:04:08 PDT 1997
We have a 1993 Suburban with a 4L60E transmission in it, that came in for a rough 1-2 shift. The shift would make the tires bark. Scanned computer to find a code 73 that has to do with current to the pressure force motor.
My technicians replaced force motor and still end up with the same code and still has a hard shift. We are wondering if anyone else has had this problem before we start changing the TPS, VSS and last but not least the ECM. I am unfamiliar with this code 73 and Snap-On has nothing listed on the Troubleshooter.
Thanks in Advance.
Don Stone - ASA Florida VP
AAA Quality Transmissions

RESPONSES;


FIX:


Mon, 3 Nov 1997 23:07:07 -0500
Just thought I would send out the fix for the 93 Suburban that would chirp the tires at 20 MPH.
We connected the old Shaeffer Shifter on the vehicle and the Transmission worked fine. We then traced the wires from the ECM to the trans and they were good with no breaks in the wiring. Now we pulled about 2 more hands full of much need hair from our heads and assumed the ECM was faulty. The code 73 would not disappear.
We ordered an ECM from the dealer for the next day and also send out our problem out to TRNi members the same night. In the morning when I got to the shop I checked our e-mail and we got a message from some members to check battery voltage and charging system. Well a two by four just hit me in the head after remembering my techs jump starting the vehicle. We swapped the battery for a good one out of a Taurus we were working on and low and behold the Transmission worked perfectly. Of course when the dealer showed up with the ECM we sent it back.
The customer was more than happy to purchase a battery instead of a transmission and it was all a result of TRNi members and this network.
All this work for a bad battery.
Thanks to all that replied.
Don Stone - ASA Florida VP
AAA Quality Transmissions
Stuart, Fla.
 


More 4L60E...

QUESTION:


I am seeing a pattern of 1996-1997 4L60e's come in with a code P1870, which in common transmission English is RATIO ERROR. Now I realize that just about any component in the transmission slipping could trip the code, but it seems to be, the TCC not engaging that is usually the cause. I have one right now that I'm working on. It locks up fine when cold, but after it gets warm, the VCM commands Lockup, but the TCC slip is well over 150 rpms, and no lockup is felt. I've hooked up the TransX2000 and monitored the actual voltage to the transmission when the VCM is commanding lockup, and the voltage is being sent from the VCM. Next I override the VCM and apply the lockup with the lockup feel PWM duty cycle at 40%, no lockup, BUT if I raise the lockup apply feel PWM duty cycle to above 55% it works. Does his tells me the oil PSI in the TCC apply circuit is too low? Sure sounds good, especially being that it only does it when hot. I've been replacing the pumps and the converters to correct this condition, but I can't see a thing wrong with them, though it does solve the problem. I know that we put in a few AODE converters before we found an easier fix. SO, here I go into the "what if" field. What if we could somehow raise the TCC apply feel PSI that was being sent TOO the PWM TCC solenoid, would it help, or even correct the no lockup condition? I looked at increasing the TCC apply feel valve spring, but the spring the factory has in it, looks like it has been taking steroids already. I think I may shim the spring tomorrow and just see. I wonder what would happen if I just blocked the apply feel valve? Here is another thought, what if we unplugged the lockup apply feel solenoid, and just plugged up a dummy solenoid to the wiring harness to satisfy the VCM? Any body got any ideas? You know I am beginning to dislike the letters PWM!
Dan Tucker

RESPONSES;


FIX:


 

518...

QUESTION:


Wed Oct 1 17:30:11 PDT 1997
Anybody dealing with any 42RE's in Jeeps? Got one that intermittently starts in 2nd or 3rd gear usually worse hot. Governor pressure drifts up to about 20-25 psi standing still. Can watch Duty Cycle signal to gov sol command it and watch gov pressure sensor track it. Also temp sensor shorts to ground when hot (loses 4th) but even when its not shorted, pig don't work right. Already has new GP Solenoid and GP sensor in it. Just wondering if anybody else has seen this.
Tod?
Thanx-Paul


RESPONSES;


FIX:


42RE- It Lives- 42RE is fixed-- Here is info for every one including info for questions asked.
The Jeep is/was a 94 model. Installed both a new GP Solenoid and sensor-same problem-20-25psi gov pressure and 2nd or 3rd starts. Also listed in the original post was info on temp sensor voltage going low (.04 volts) when hot and losing 4th gear. I was monitoring gov solenoid duty cycle and gp sensor voltage with digital graphing multimeter. Both would dither and fluctuate together and drift up to produce high gov at standstill. Hard to know if sensor is faulty or skewed and command is trying to deliver pressure command signal to make it read right or is solenoid faulty and sensor correct? Anyway both new didn't fix it. Decided to fix what could be proven bad-temp sensor. Replaced ONLY the temp sensor from a "donor" vb I had. I got a tip (thanks Wayne) that Chrysler allegedly had a problem with temp and GP sensor grounds being tied together and on new design harnesses are seperate (true Ken?) . So I separated mine and gave temp sensor its own ground since I was splicing it onto the original harness anyway. All back in and works fine hot and cold. GP Solenoid and sensor are steady and correct and work in proportion to vehicle speed. One last thing I didn't mention or pay attention to before was the GPDC and GP sensor volts wavered up and down at 55 mph. After "fix" it was steady as a rock. Temp voltage hot was approx 3.3v instead of .04v as before. No loss of 4th either. Good diagnostic tip from Ken Potter on GP sensor- If sensor voltage is high in park or neutral it is a bad sensor/circuit, not solenoid-there is no feed to GP sol in P or N so even if it was stuck open wouldn't make high sensor volts. At this time (in some ways) not all this problem/fix makes total sense to me. I have found before if you see something definately wrong even though it may not SEEM to be directly related to your problem, that many times it is.
???????
Paul

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